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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
New to forum earlier this week. I'm an old fan of the Z dating back to the 1970s with the 240Z. Friend owned one and then another good friend purchased a new 280ZX. Then my Dad in 1986 bought new 300ZX that he loved & owned for 15 years and paired with my Moms new Caddy's.

That said, I ordered new Z in 2002 but then changed my mind & cancelled contract and ordered New BMW 325ci with 5 speed manual. Been a BMW Coupe guy since and have owned 3.. latest one was a 230i.

Obviously seems the Z excitement was lacking since 2010. I checked US sales and from 2011-19 the Z sold well under 10k cars each year and eventually dipped below 5k for those last 3-4 years. Curious why/how did the 370Z lose the love??

What did Nissan do wrong then and why all the excitement now; Is this new Z really that much better than the 370z? I've read its still built on same chassis but yes many improvements. Anyway should be fun waiting for it and then comparing vs. other Vehicles. I am considering purchasing one but time will tell
 

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I think Nissan's biggest issue with most of their models has been riding out a model for as long as they can without a meaningful refresh. Especially with a car like the Z, the longer that gen model is produced, the more dated and less special it begins to feel. Hopefully being under new leadership will lead to changes more often and keep the cars feeling competitive with other brands.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
also the 370Z and 350Z were very similar, harks back to my 350Z order in 2002. I guess that's why sales volume tanked after 2010. But glad to hear Nissan has kept the Z alive with this new model!!

Also, prices have increased way above inflation since the 240Z Era. For example; using sales price estimate of $3,500 in 1970 that equates to almost $25k in 2021 dollars. No where close to the stated starting price of $40k. And if Nissan pushes Performance model close to $50k that is dangerous territory and may knock me out.... unfortunately
 

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I grew up in the era of Z31 and Z32, and had lots of friends with S30 Zs. I also had the 300ZX powered 200SX SE V6 back in the day.

I had signed up for the then-new Z in around 2002, when Nissan first said they'd be bringing back the Z. I even received free Z swag, that I still have somewhere, for the new upcoming car.
Man, when that car was released, I was disgusted. It was weird. The weird door handles with 3 squares (supposedly a new Z motif?!?) and the weird design language. I later learned that Ghosn/Renault had been forcing French-car weirdness onto Nissan (remember the disgusting 2004+ Gen 6 Maximas??) and that the Z was somewhat influenced.

When the Z34 came out, I was likewise disappointed. Now that we have the new Z shown in production trim, it is easy to see how ungainly and ugly the Z34 is with it's weird taillights and headlights. It's bulbuous and stubby compared to the 5" longer new Z, which uses visual tricks to make it look low and wide, like a proper sports car.

I never took issue with the Z33 and Z34 performance specs, and I have a Q60 with the VQ37 in it which is a great NA V6.
I had just always hoped that the Z33 and subsequent Zs would have picked up on the design language from previous Zs..
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
you nailed it right here in your response.... "It's bulbuous and stubby compared to the 5" longer new Z, which uses visual tricks to make it look low and wide, like a proper sports car".

Part of reason why i chose the 3 series Coupe instead back then. Was striking when I compared to the 2002 Z that I was initially excited over...
 

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you nailed it right here in your response.... "It's bulbuous and stubby compared to the 5" longer new Z, which uses visual tricks to make it look low and wide, like a proper sports car".

Part of reason why i chose the 3 series Coupe instead back then. Was striking when I compared to the 2002 Z that I was initially excited over...
No doubt, BMW usually does excellent designs. The new super-kidney grilles....yikes, not so much anymore.

I am so glad Ghosn is gone, it seems every Nissan released since his departure has been SOLID (I know vehicle development time takes years, so they must have marginalized the French/Ghosn aspect years ago while building a case against Ghosn). The new Sentra actually looks decent, and the new Pathfinder looks excellent, for a mall crawler. And Nissan even put a real transmission in it! I think Nissan is about to become competitive again before the decade is out.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
agree on the new BMW 4 series Grill.. way too big & ugly. Not a huge fan yet of the larger rectangle opening on the new Z... looks like they could have softened it a bit. Pix below is my recently sold 230i with M Sports pkg... love the front spoiler and will be forever missed. I'm also looking at the new BMW 2 series built on new G42 Chassis coming out in November
2404
 

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agree on the new BMW 4 series Grill.. way too big & ugly. Not a huge fan yet of the larger rectangle opening on the new Z... looks like they could have softened it a bit. Pix below is my recently sold 230i with M Sports pkg... love the front spoiler and will be forever missed. I'm also looking at the new BMW 2 series built on new G42 Chassis coming out in November View attachment 2404
I'm just gonna tell you right now, the BMW is probably the right car for you. BMW performance is always exceptional. I know if the new Z nips on the heels of the BMW Supra, BMW will just throw a new tune at it and that'll be the end of that.

Personally, I'm getting a new Z for emotional reasons, not because it does anything better on paper. After driving my friend's Tesla Model 3 Performance a few times, I have just stopped caring which car can nudge out what, because if a Tesla pulls up, y'all are losing. I think Nissan smartly decided to tap a demographic of people using emotion, I bet at least 1/3 of new Z buyers buy one because of past experience many moons ago.
It'd be tough to justify a true 2 seater to a person who cares more about performance metrics and keeps a car less than 5 years. These cars are going to people with discretionary funds (or well-off young people a few years away from baby seats). Even a BMW concedes to everyday usability.
My Z is going to be something my kid needs to deal with when I'm dead. Whether or not he keeps it, up to him. A Japanese 2 seater with a 6MT and really good power in 2022+ is going to be a loud footnote in ICE history.
 

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I grew up in the era of Z31 and Z32, and had lots of friends with S30 Zs. I also had the 300ZX powered 200SX SE V6 back in the day.

I had signed up for the then-new Z in around 2002, when Nissan first said they'd be bringing back the Z. I even received free Z swag, that I still have somewhere, for the new upcoming car.
Man, when that car was released, I was disgusted. It was weird. The weird door handles with 3 squares (supposedly a new Z motif?!?) and the weird design language. I later learned that Ghosn/Renault had been forcing French-car weirdness onto Nissan (remember the disgusting 2004+ Gen 6 Maximas??) and that the Z was somewhat influenced.

When the Z34 came out, I was likewise disappointed. Now that we have the new Z shown in production trim, it is easy to see how ungainly and ugly the Z34 is with it's weird taillights and headlights. It's bulbuous and stubby compared to the 5" longer new Z, which uses visual tricks to make it look low and wide, like a proper sports car.

I never took issue with the Z33 and Z34 performance specs, and I have a Q60 with the VQ37 in it which is a great NA V6.
I had just always hoped that the Z33 and subsequent Zs would have picked up on the design language from previous Zs..
Don’t forget when you are talking about the new Z, it’s still Z34, the body panels have been thinned out, and suspension geometry has (supposedly) been changed but it’s still a modified Z34 at the end of the day, even if it’s been substantially reconfigured.
 

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Don’t forget when you are talking about the new Z, it’s still Z34, the body panels have been thinned out, and suspension geometry has (supposedly) been changed but it’s still a modified Z34 at the end of the day, even if it’s been substantially reconfigured.
In my head, I call it a "Z34.5", and I also call it a "Datsun 300Z" so take that for what it's worth!
 

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I'm just gonna tell you right now, the BMW is probably the right car for you. BMW performance is always exceptional. I know if the new Z nips on the heels of the BMW Supra, BMW will just throw a new tune at it and that'll be the end of that.

Personally, I'm getting a new Z for emotional reasons, not because it does anything better on paper. After driving my friend's Tesla Model 3 Performance a few times, I have just stopped caring which car can nudge out what, because if a Tesla pulls up, y'all are losing. I think Nissan smartly decided to tap a demographic of people using emotion, I bet at least 1/3 of new Z buyers buy one because of past experience many moons ago.
It'd be tough to justify a true 2 seater to a person who cares more about performance metrics and keeps a car less than 5 years. These cars are going to people with discretionary funds (or well-off young people a few years away from baby seats). Even a BMW concedes to everyday usability.
My Z is going to be something my kid needs to deal with when I'm dead. Whether or not he keeps it, up to him. A Japanese 2 seater with a 6MT and really good power in 2022+ is going to be a loud footnote in ICE history.
This.

I had a '78 280 5 speed that I had to give up when my first wife got pregnant. It wasn't the fastest car I've ever owned, but no car I've owned before or since has been as much fun to drive. I'm buying this one and keeping it forever.
 

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I love thre 350z, still have my silver Track edition from 2004 that I baby. Just couldn't get myself to like the 370z. Felt it was too bulbous and reminded me of a frog, compared to the simple smooth hood and styling of the 350z.

Now this new Nissan.... damn I like it even better than my beloved 350z! The weirdest thing is I was on the fence when I saw the Z proto, but for some bizarre reason the production model looks much better to me
 

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Sports cars cannot be divorced from their aesthetics. An ugly sports car pushes that from a bit of an indulgence for a good looking sports car, to an un-necessary expense with a hurdle to overcome for a bad looking one.

Pair that with aging technology and amenities... and it becomes an un-necessary, unwanted, unsuccessful product.
Chassis, power, handling, even price point, were not 370Z's problem, and with a few iterative changes, it won't be Z35's problem, either.

Good looks, updated amenities, and fixing some mechanical nuisances makes a bigger difference than one would think, because the fundamentals were not that far off, only the appeal aspects.

BTW, if 350Z to 370Z was a worth an incremental increase, from Z33 to Z34... then the new Z with a new body, updated interior, and a whole new engine is worth an incremental increase to Z35.
 

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yeah In all honestly I never had a lot of excitement or attachment for the 370z like I did the 350. partly because it came out almost exactly the same time I moved away from the Z to the GTR world for like a whole decade. more aesthetically the head and taillights were kind of a "fad" design of the times and they aged very quickly also had some lines that made it look a little bloated. that design over stayed its welcome


With the 350 it felt totally new I was just out of college it was my first manual car. then when the HR motor came out and the 350z got the refresh with the lights that car felt like the sweet spot and a clean well kept 350 to me has aged well. its just the 370z lights just scream mid 2000's blah. I drove a couple and they felt great and the NISMO helped with the looks a bit. if the 370 would have went away by 2015 or something it would have been remembered a little better to me in retrospect but 11 years just did it no favors with no real midlife refresh at all
 

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I'm just gonna tell you right now, the BMW is probably the right car for you. BMW performance is always exceptional. I know if the new Z nips on the heels of the BMW Supra, BMW will just throw a new tune at it and that'll be the end of that.

Personally, I'm getting a new Z for emotional reasons, not because it does anything better on paper. After driving my friend's Tesla Model 3 Performance a few times, I have just stopped caring which car can nudge out what, because if a Tesla pulls up, y'all are losing. I think Nissan smartly decided to tap a demographic of people using emotion, I bet at least 1/3 of new Z buyers buy one because of past experience many moons ago.
It'd be tough to justify a true 2 seater to a person who cares more about performance metrics and keeps a car less than 5 years. These cars are going to people with discretionary funds (or well-off young people a few years away from baby seats). Even a BMW concedes to everyday usability.
My Z is going to be something my kid needs to deal with when I'm dead. Whether or not he keeps it, up to him. A Japanese 2 seater with a 6MT and really good power in 2022+ is going to be a loud footnote in ICE history.
Very well said. Tenths don’t matter to enthusiasts. Dilettantes, punky kids and pretenders want car magazine-produced 0-60 bragging rights. I disagree with you on the “Supra”, though. A new tune and a few more hp than the Z (and the upcoming addition of a stick) won’t make it less ugly, nor will it give the BMW internals long term reliability or lower maintenance costs.
 

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Don’t forget when you are talking about the new Z, it’s still Z34, the body panels have been thinned out, and suspension geometry has (supposedly) been changed but it’s still a modified Z34 at the end of the day, even if it’s been substantially reconfigured.
That’s not a bad thing. A tested platform with improvements - hopefully - to all the pertinent areas, combined with a “new” engine that’s been out for years means reliability shouldn’t be much of an issue - theoretically. Aside from the “radically” different engine (TT vs NA) evolutionary changes were all the platform needed given its relatively affordable price point. Remember, it’s going to be a low volume car so reusing the Z34 was the only way Nissan could afford to give us a genuine Z car starting under $40K.
 

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The topic of how "old" the platform is, has been fairly relevant to me lately.

I have been test driving new vehicles lately (as they are finally available!) and I may show up to the dealer in a 2014 Q60 (essentially a 2008 G37 coupe) or a 2007 Titan.

Albeit, I have not driven a new BMW M240, which I am sure is amazing, as is a Supra.... the whole idea that a platform should be all-new doesn't really mean much these days. I am never so impressed with new 2022 machines that I feel bad about my older machines. There doesn't seem to be any obvious benefit to the newer chassis. All of the "goodies" are just technology related. Sure, the 14" infotainment in the new Tundra I drove was NICE, but as a truck, I still feel the 2007 Titan is extremely competitive, despite being nearly 20 years older of a design.
I've driven a few new cars, and getting into my 2007-era Q60 makes me realize that we really have not come very far, TBH. Sure, BMW will be the standard bearer, it always has been. And the Tesla will rip your face off. But, I highly doubt the "old" FM platform in the new Z is going to affect sales and enjoyment one bit.

Sure, an armchair expert can point it out all day long, but these older cars were pretty much figured out a long time ago.

For anybody who was/is into skateboarding, I liken it to the development of the skateboard. Many years ago we had "whale tales" "no nose" "double tail" "skinny" "wide" skateboards. They all looked wildly different and behaved wildly different. In the late 90's the "popsicle" style skateboard pretty much took over, and nowadays all skateboards are very close in design to each other, besides width, length and graphics, they are all essentially the same these days.
 

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It’s ironic that the very reason the 370Z started selling in such small quantities (i.e., its age) will likely be inextricably tied to the reason it becomes more sought after in years to come: It’s one of the last fully analog driver’s cars, naturallly aspirated, without the safety bells and whistles, etc. that are peppered throughout every newer vehicle, including the new Z.
Make no mistake, I’m getting the new Z as soon as I can get my hands on one, but I’m starting to think picking up a low-miles or even a brand new 370Z might not be a bad idea either.
 
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